Difference between revisions of "Rec.games.pinball Access Methods"
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I would like to move the news reader debate from preference/opinion to a fact-based comparison. If this develops into a useful comparison I suggest we post it into a PinWiki article. I've started a comparison list. Please feel free to correct and expand my list, but try to keep it fact-based. | I would like to move the news reader debate from preference/opinion to a fact-based comparison. If this develops into a useful comparison I suggest we post it into a PinWiki article. I've started a comparison list. Please feel free to correct and expand my list, but try to keep it fact-based. | ||
| − | Background: I use(d) mainly Google Groups for access. My ISP-provided NNTP server is only available from their network (and I have concerns that it will be removed). I recently signed up for the free text-only [http://eternal-september.org http://eternal-september.org] server. I have only accessed the newsgroup directly via Outlook Express and Thunderbird. I also signed up for | + | Background: I use(d) mainly Google Groups for access. My ISP-provided NNTP server is only available from their network (and I have concerns that it will be removed). I recently signed up for the free text-only [http://eternal-september.org http://www.eternal-september.org] server. I have only accessed the newsgroup directly via Outlook Express and Thunderbird. I also signed up for rgparchive.com (Note: Site is offline) so I could understand it better. |
Newsgroups: rec.games.pinball is a Usenet newsgroup. History of the group can be found in the FAQ at [http://www.mrpinball.com http://www.mrpinball.com]. See wikipedia for information on Usenet and NNTP servers. Newsgroups predate modern web browsers. If I recall correctly, the dejanews web site that provided newsgroup access was purchased by Google. Other web options have evolved, but it should be understood that they only provide a portal to post and view the newsgroup posts, a shadow copy if you will. The NNTP server system itself is highly redundant and very robust, as is the core of the internet. | Newsgroups: rec.games.pinball is a Usenet newsgroup. History of the group can be found in the FAQ at [http://www.mrpinball.com http://www.mrpinball.com]. See wikipedia for information on Usenet and NNTP servers. Newsgroups predate modern web browsers. If I recall correctly, the dejanews web site that provided newsgroup access was purchased by Google. Other web options have evolved, but it should be understood that they only provide a portal to post and view the newsgroup posts, a shadow copy if you will. The NNTP server system itself is highly redundant and very robust, as is the core of the internet. | ||
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*Disadvantages: | *Disadvantages: | ||
| − | **Need client software (e.g. [http://www.mozilla.org/en-US/thunderbird/ Thunderbird], | + | **Need client software (e.g. [http://www.mozilla.org/en-US/thunderbird/ Thunderbird] (Windows, Mac, or Linux), [http://www.seamonkey-project.org/ SeaMonkey] (Windows, Mac, or Linux), Outlook Express |
**Sorting of unread threads is not as convenient as Google Groups | **Sorting of unread threads is not as convenient as Google Groups | ||
**Any customization must be duplicated on other computers used for access | **Any customization must be duplicated on other computers used for access | ||
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**Read/Unread status is maintained on the server, so current from wherever you access | **Read/Unread status is maintained on the server, so current from wherever you access | ||
**"Favorites" flagging allows easy tracking of threads you're interested in | **"Favorites" flagging allows easy tracking of threads you're interested in | ||
| − | **SPAM and Troll posts are flagged by community and hidden | + | **SPAM and Troll posts are flagged by community and hidden (see disadvantages for more information) |
**Search capability within group | **Search capability within group | ||
**Adding "in rec.games.pinball" to a standard Google search will take you directly to the thread | **Adding "in rec.games.pinball" to a standard Google search will take you directly to the thread | ||
| + | **Replies to old posts always has the complete thread available for reference | ||
| + | **The NEW Google Groups supports keyboard shortcuts, shift+j = Next Topic, shift+n = Next Post. See Settings -> Keyboard Shortcuts for a complete list. | ||
*Disadvantages: | *Disadvantages: | ||
| − | **Google outages with their Usenet feed (a fairly regular occurrence: 2011 June 27, 4 days; July 27, | + | **Google outages with their Usenet feed (a fairly regular occurrence: 2011 June 27, 4 days; July 27, 11 days) |
**Topics open a new page to display the thread | **Topics open a new page to display the thread | ||
**Typically more lag before posts show up than when using a dedicated Newsreader | **Typically more lag before posts show up than when using a dedicated Newsreader | ||
| + | **'''NOTE:''' As of September 2011, post deletion on Google Groups has made this option nearly useless. Be aware if you are using this option that you are only seeing a fraction of the total posts. Many posts that are getting deleted are NOT off-topic or abusive. | ||
| − | '''3 | + | '''3. rgparchive.com - Note: this site is no longer online. This was a privately maintained portal courtesy of RGP contributor "Nacman"'''. |
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At bottom left, select "Add Other Account" from "Account Actions" pull-down. | At bottom left, select "Add Other Account" from "Account Actions" pull-down. | ||
| − | [[Image:thunderbird_rgp_setup_step1.gif | + | [[Image:thunderbird_rgp_setup_step1.gif|left|ThunderBird Setup Step 1]] |
<br clear=all> | <br clear=all> | ||
Select "Newsgroup Account" and click [Next]. Enter your name (the name that will show up on newsgroup posts) and your e-mail address and click [Next]. For "Newsgroup Server" enter "news.eternal-september.org". Click [Next] and then [Finish]. | Select "Newsgroup Account" and click [Next]. Enter your name (the name that will show up on newsgroup posts) and your e-mail address and click [Next]. For "Newsgroup Server" enter "news.eternal-september.org". Click [Next] and then [Finish]. | ||
| − | [[Image:thunderbird_rgp_setup_step2.gif | + | [[Image:thunderbird_rgp_setup_step2.gif|left|ThunderBird Setup Step 2]] |
<br clear=all> | <br clear=all> | ||
Highlight news.eternal-september.org in the left-hand pane and view the settings. Set the settings according to the following figure. | Highlight news.eternal-september.org in the left-hand pane and view the settings. Set the settings according to the following figure. | ||
| − | [[Image:thunderbird_rgp_setup_step3.gif | + | [[Image:thunderbird_rgp_setup_step3.gif|left|ThunderBird Setup Step 3]] |
<br clear=all> | <br clear=all> | ||
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As a start, "t" goes to next unread thread, "n" goes to next unread post. Right-click on rec.games.pinball and select "Mark Newsgroup Read" to mark all entries as read. | As a start, "t" goes to next unread thread, "n" goes to next unread post. Right-click on rec.games.pinball and select "Mark Newsgroup Read" to mark all entries as read. | ||
| − | [[Image:thunderbird_rgp_setup_step4.gif | + | [[Image:thunderbird_rgp_setup_step4.gif|left|ThunderBird Setup Step 4]] |
<br clear=all> | <br clear=all> | ||
Latest revision as of 18:42, 6 September 2021
Originally posted on RGP by Kerry Imming (this article modified slightly from the original post)...
I would like to move the news reader debate from preference/opinion to a fact-based comparison. If this develops into a useful comparison I suggest we post it into a PinWiki article. I've started a comparison list. Please feel free to correct and expand my list, but try to keep it fact-based.
Background: I use(d) mainly Google Groups for access. My ISP-provided NNTP server is only available from their network (and I have concerns that it will be removed). I recently signed up for the free text-only http://www.eternal-september.org server. I have only accessed the newsgroup directly via Outlook Express and Thunderbird. I also signed up for rgparchive.com (Note: Site is offline) so I could understand it better.
Newsgroups: rec.games.pinball is a Usenet newsgroup. History of the group can be found in the FAQ at http://www.mrpinball.com. See wikipedia for information on Usenet and NNTP servers. Newsgroups predate modern web browsers. If I recall correctly, the dejanews web site that provided newsgroup access was purchased by Google. Other web options have evolved, but it should be understood that they only provide a portal to post and view the newsgroup posts, a shadow copy if you will. The NNTP server system itself is highly redundant and very robust, as is the core of the internet.
Access Options:
1. News server and client news reader - This is the traditional way to access newsgroups.
- Advantages:
- Reliable - you can subscribe to multiple NNTP servers
- Free servers (http://www.eternal-september.org) and client software available
- Paid (i.e. supported) servers are available
- Message rules can be created to automatically flag posts based on content
- Flagged threads can be sorted to the top
- Fast navigation since it's client-based
- Disadvantages:
- Need client software (e.g. Thunderbird (Windows, Mac, or Linux), SeaMonkey (Windows, Mac, or Linux), Outlook Express
- Sorting of unread threads is not as convenient as Google Groups
- Any customization must be duplicated on other computers used for access
2. Google Groups - News posts are ported into the Google Group interface structure
- Advantages:
- Web based, can be accessed from any computer and some mobile devices at https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/rec.games.pinball
- Read/Unread status is maintained on the server, so current from wherever you access
- "Favorites" flagging allows easy tracking of threads you're interested in
- SPAM and Troll posts are flagged by community and hidden (see disadvantages for more information)
- Search capability within group
- Adding "in rec.games.pinball" to a standard Google search will take you directly to the thread
- Replies to old posts always has the complete thread available for reference
- The NEW Google Groups supports keyboard shortcuts, shift+j = Next Topic, shift+n = Next Post. See Settings -> Keyboard Shortcuts for a complete list.
- Disadvantages:
- Google outages with their Usenet feed (a fairly regular occurrence: 2011 June 27, 4 days; July 27, 11 days)
- Topics open a new page to display the thread
- Typically more lag before posts show up than when using a dedicated Newsreader
- NOTE: As of September 2011, post deletion on Google Groups has made this option nearly useless. Be aware if you are using this option that you are only seeing a fraction of the total posts. Many posts that are getting deleted are NOT off-topic or abusive.
3. rgparchive.com - Note: this site is no longer online. This was a privately maintained portal courtesy of RGP contributor "Nacman".
1 Newsgroup Reader Features
Outlook Express provides the option (view -> current view -> Display Messages by Conversation) of displaying topics as expandable groups. Groups expand in place in the upper pane with the text for the selected message available in the lower pane. Double-clicking a message opens it in a new window where navigation icons or keyboard shortcuts (e.g. ctrl+u) can be used to navigate to the next post.
Messages shown in red have been selected as "follow", indicated by the small "glasses" icon. Topics can be followed by clicking in the "follow" column in the topic pane or in search results. User generated rules can provide automatic processing of messages. In this case messages with "Tech EM" in the subject are automatically marked to "follow".
Note that in Outlook Express new replies are grouped under the expandable topic and the topic is displayed as unread. For replies to old posts you need to scroll down to see the unread messages since the topic/subject time stamp is based on the original post. The topic pane can be changed to disable grouping, but then the complete thread is not easily visible.
Headings are clickable to allow sorting by Sent (date), From (user), and follow (bring topics you're following to the top).
The Google Groups interface displays the ungrouped list of current posts. Unread messages are highlighted and that state is maintained on the server so it is available wherever you view the group. Not shown in this picture is the way SPAM and Troll posts are displayed. Based on feedback from other users, they show up as a greyed out "This topic has been hidden" subject. They can still be viewed, but they're easy to ignore.
Double-clicking a topic opens a new page with a view of the entire thread. In contrast to the news reader, which may not have messages for
replies to very old threads, the full thread is always available. Links at the top right provide navigation to previous, next, or unread threads.
A feature in Google Groups is the "show activity" option on the pull-down menu in the message. This displays a page with a summary of posts by that userid. This is handy to find out if the poster is new and a quick way to review their postings to understand their pinball knowledge level.
2 ThunderBird RGP Setup Instructions
Install Mozilla Thunderbird and get a free USENET account at www.eternal-september.org.
In Thunderbird, select "Tools" -> "Account Settings".
At bottom left, select "Add Other Account" from "Account Actions" pull-down.
Select "Newsgroup Account" and click [Next]. Enter your name (the name that will show up on newsgroup posts) and your e-mail address and click [Next]. For "Newsgroup Server" enter "news.eternal-september.org". Click [Next] and then [Finish].
Highlight news.eternal-september.org in the left-hand pane and view the settings. Set the settings according to the following figure.
When you select "Manage newsgroup subscriptions" you'll be prompted to enter you eternal-september userid and password. Click the box to save the userid if you don't want to enter it every time you access the newsgroup.
In the "Show items that contain:" box, enter "pinball" and select rec.games.pinball. Click [subscribe].
The news reader screen should look similar to the following picture. Check the "View" an "Go" menu pulldowns for options.
As a start, "t" goes to next unread thread, "n" goes to next unread post. Right-click on rec.games.pinball and select "Mark Newsgroup Read" to mark all entries as read.
